You Can Scrub, But You Can't Hide
Frederick Clarkson printable version print page     Bookmark and Share
Sat Dec 20, 2008 at 02:17:55 PM EST
The other day I wrote piece for Religion Dispatches (Gimme That Old Spice Religion) that highlighted, among other things, one of the struggles of today's theocrats living in a constitutional democracy that is not much to their liking. The problem is the right of women to vote. Many a theocrat believes that God is against it, and will wax nostalgic for the halcyon days of yore when, well... things were different. But since women do have the right to vote, what then should theocrats do?  

I linked to a 2005 essay by theocratic theorist Brian Abshire that seeks to address this knotty problem.

It was originally, and apparently exclusively, posted at the web site of Vision Forum, headed by Christian home schooling entrepreneur, Doug Phillips. But nerves seem to be raw about this subject. Abshire's essay has suddenly apparently been scrubbed from the site. But thanks to the archival wonders of the internet, you can scrub but you can't hide!

Much more on the flip.

Here is what Abshire has to say about women and voting in Biblical Patriarchy and the Doctrine of Federal Representation:

Until the twentieth century...  The reason why women were not allowed to vote had nothing to do with women being considered "inferior" or "too emotional" (these values arose during the Victorian era and were themselves theologically and socially deviant) but rather because the husband and father was ASSUMED to represent the family to the broader community. By definition, there could only be ONE representative of the family just as there could only be ONE representative of the Human Race to God!

... By the 20th century, American Christians saw the "height" of Christian activism as banning alcohol while at the same time affirming a woman's right to vote. Both ideas were unmitigated disasters; God has not allowed the civil magistrate to outlaw wine and God does not allow women to vote (cf. 1 Tim 2:11ff). But by ignoring God's law, American Christians both destroyed their own credibility (the Prohibition era is STILL a matter of public ridicule and repealing prohibition set the legal precedence for pornography, sodomy and the acceptance of other moral failures) and the integrity of own families.

In regards to a woman's right to vote; if husband and wife are truly "one flesh" and the husband is doing his duty to represent the family to the wider community, then what PRACTICAL benefit does allowing women to vote provide? If husband and wife agree on an issue, then one has simply doubled the number of votes; but the result is the same. Women's voting only makes a difference when the husband and wife disagree; a wife, who does not trust the judgment of her husband, can nullify his vote. Thus, the immediate consequence is to enshrine the will of the individual OVER the good of the family thus creating divisions WITHIN the family.

That seems clear to me. But apparently, there is quite a discussion still going on about that essay in conservative Christian circles.

Meanwhile, Jennifer Chancey, (wife of Matthew, the main subject of my article, as the winner of the Old Spice-sponsored, Art of Manliness' Man of the Year competition) discussed views very similar to Abshire's in a newspaper article in the heat of her husband's unsuccessful campaign for Alabama Public Service Commission. It must be tough figuring out how to campaign for votes when you believe that women should submit their votes to their husband's so they do not cancel each other out. Such are the ideological and practical woes of the modern theocrat.

Meanwhile, Kathryn Joyce, who I interviewed for my story, sent me a transcript of a interview with Jennifer Chancey that appears in the film The Monstrous Regiment of Women:

Chancey: "The bottom line is that God created men for leadership. He clearly says in his Word, when women are in leadership, it's a sign of a curse on a nation. Basically saying, you've messed up so badly, I'm going to put children and women over top of you. You are only fit to be ruled by women."

Narrator: "Today in America, 7.8 million more women vote than men. America is now indicted under this verse, Isaiah 3:12. 'Children are their oppressors and women rule over them. The men of the suffrage era were willing to abdicate their dominion role in that they were willing to give up half of their electoral power to women. The 19th Amendment can be seen as the point in American history when the fahters ceased to sit in the gates as representatives of their families' interests: individualism and self-interest would now be the approach to the ballot box."

There is much more to the Christian patriarchy movement as discussed by Phillips, Chancey and Abshire. And fortunately there is a book coming out that throws the windows open on this important but obscure movement.

Kathryn Joyce's book Quiverfull: Inside the Christian Patriarchy Movement is due out from Beacon Press in March.




Display:
Have they been informed as to Matthew and Jennie Chauncey's opinions and asked whether the judges who selected him agree that women shouldn't vote?

I am a woman who isn't into "metrosexual pretty boys." Therefore, I like that they sponsor my favorite racecar driver, the sexy and decidedly not metro Tony Stewart. Lots of other female NASCAR fans like him, too. And women are the main purchasers of mens' cologne--we buy for boyfriends, husbands, brothers, and friends. Straight and bi men want our input on their scents. And you know, there are *lots* of great scents out there, and it *is* a tough economy.

Therefore, Old Spice needs to be put on notice that they cannot afford to alienate women in this way. There is a meaningful difference between "a manly man" and "a knuckle-dragging Neanderthal by choice."

by GreenEyed Lilo on Sat Dec 20, 2008 at 06:57:35 PM EST

(as I reported in the original article) stated that they did not want to know about the contestants religious, political and social views, and said that they made no investigation of their backgrounds. They said they relied on the nomination essay and references. (There was no indication as to who the contestants references were.)  

So Old Spice and the webzine sponsors claim they knew nothing, in advance.  That does not absolve them of responsibility of course.  And I would guess that Old Spice, at least, has some repair work to do with their customers.

by Frederick Clarkson on Sat Dec 20, 2008 at 11:48:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]



they freeped a poll of a deeply unpopular aftershave.

by strayroots on Sun Dec 21, 2008 at 05:32:45 AM EST

The canceling of votes is only relevant to a two-party system like the in the States. I suppose that the Christian right is not a big fan of a more diverse political climate? Or are they?

Being a European (Swedish), I cannot understand (although I vaguely know the historical reasons) the, in my view, non-dynamical political system. Not to mention the extremely mysterious voting system. I may be completely out of my right to express my view but I suspect that the world would be a better place with a more fair democratic structure of the world's only super power (should I count China perhaps; well democracy is a concept not easily applied to China anyway).


by numberlab on Mon Dec 22, 2008 at 09:51:36 AM EST



WWW Talk To Action


Ah, True Remonstrance!
In previous posts I have called for mainstream Catholics to offer remonstrance - an earnest presentation of reasons for opposition or grievance against the......
By Frank Cocozzelli (4 comments)
Congressman Wants Citizens of ALL Religions to Reflect on the Ten Commandments
Well, spring is in the air, and that can mean only one thing. It's time for a member of Congress to introduce a resolution......
By Chris Rodda (0 comments)
Happy Birthday, Pat!: Virginia Legislature Lauds Extremist TV Preacher Robertson
TV evangelist Pat Robertson's 80th birthday is on Monday, and to mark that momentous occasion, the Virginia legislature decided to pass a resolution lauding......
By Rob Boston (1 comment)
Netanyahu and Hagee, Serial Obstructionists
Last week I wrote about Prime Minister Netanyahu's participation at John Hagee's CUFI rally held in Jerusalem on the evening of Joe Biden's arrival......
By Rachel Tabachnick (0 comments)
Bill Donohue: Defender of Glenn Beck.
Glenn Beck's recent admonition that people who attend a church that teaches social justice should leave -- was anti-Catholicism. This was obvious from a......
By Frank Cocozzelli (5 comments)
Blog Against Theocracy!
It's that time of year again.  It's time for the annual Blog Against Theocracy, April 2-4, 2010.   The prime mover of this blogtacular......
By Frederick Clarkson (1 comment)
Creeping Religious Rightism in the Democratic Party, Cont.
  Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State has an op-ed today at AOL News discussing how, campaign......
By Frederick Clarkson (6 comments)
Invoking Intolerance: Religious Right Throws Fit Over Islamic Prayer In Virginia
Today an imam delivered the opening prayer before the Virginia House of Delegates - and once again the Religious Right is having kittens. Three......
By Rob Boston (1 comment)
Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu and John Hagee Share Stage as Biden Arrives in Israel
Yesterday (Monday) Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu spoke to hundreds of Christian Zionists in Jerusalem at an event organized by John Hagee and Christians......
By Rachel Tabachnick (6 comments)
When the Truth Is Shown to Be Lies
It's been a year since President Obama lifted the Bush administration's restrictions on the federal funding of embryonic stem cell research.  Nevertheless, religious opponents......
By Frank Cocozzelli (7 comments)
Repent Amarillo's Spiritual Mapping and Vigilantism
Repent Amarillo, a Texas ministry which refers to itself as an "Army of God,"  is making news for its spiritual warfare and vigilante tactics.......
By Rachel Tabachnick (17 comments)
Whale Tale: AFA Staffer Says Bible Mandates Death For SeaWorld Orca
On Feb. 24, a tragedy occurred at SeaWorld in Orlando, Fla. A six-ton killer whale known as Tillikum pulled trainer Dawn Brancheau underwater to......
By Rob Boston (5 comments)
A Call to Censor the Religion Blogosphere
Some time ago, I filled out a survey from the Social Science Research Council (SSRC) in connection with an academic study they were doing......
By Frederick Clarkson (8 comments)
Prayer Warriors of the New Apostolic Reformation Getting Some Exposure
Yesterday Alternet published an article by Bill Berkowitz including an interview with me about the New Apostolic Reformation, or the "largest religious movement you......
By Rachel Tabachnick (8 comments)
Role Models of Remonstrance
I recently called for mainstream Catholics to offer remonstrance -- an earnest presentation of reasons for opposition or grievance against the reactionaries now fomenting......
By Frank Cocozzelli (8 comments)

Publicizing the existence of the NAR -- some suggestions
Some regular columnists here on Talk to Action have complained about difficulties in getting the mass media to notice the existence of a new but rapidly growing - and already highly influential - religious......
Diane Vera (2 comments)
School Board, State and school prayer
Now both the Polk County School Board and the state of Florida are trying to push prayers in the schools! ......
ArchaeoBob (0 comments)
City in trouble for sectarian prayers
The city of Lakeland, Florida has been challenged by Atheists of Florida and the local synagogue for having sectarian prayers before public meetings. ......
ArchaeoBob (0 comments)
The Blind Side's Blind Spot
The hit movie, The Blind Side, is all about the Christian values of being your "brother's keeper." Or is it? ......
John Sheirer (3 comments)
When Christianity is Un-American
Just thought readers might be interested in linking to this article at The Yurica Report: ......
TMurray (1 comment)
Violence increasing
I think people should read this article- and realize that the dominionists are becoming more and more violent.  If something isn't done to counter their hate, this country is in deep trouble! ......
ArchaeoBob (3 comments)
His "Freedom" Means Denying Yours - With Your Own Taxes
Referring to recent political skirmishes over the rights of gays and lesbians to marry, Cardinal Francis George called five rocks thrown at empty buildings and the theft of a few lawn signs "quasi-fascism."  He......
bettyclermont (0 comments)
Rome has spoken....Man the lifeboats!
When Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger was elected Pope Benedict XVI in 2005, it was widely reported that he preferred a smaller, more obedient flock in his Church. Once again, he is proving those reports to......
bettyclermont (0 comments)
Your children will be forced to shower with gays! (says the AFA)
I've just received the following American Family Association email, which claims that the Obama administration has a nefarious plan to force gays and straights in the US military to shower together ! Donald Wildmon......
Bruce Wilson (3 comments)
Pope John Paul II's Penitential Practices: The Opus Dei Connection
We are pleased to once again welcome theologian William Lindsey as a guest front pager. This piece is crossposted from the new progressive Catholic group blog, The Open Tabernacle: Here Comes Everybody. -- FC......
William Lindsey (0 comments)
WallBuilders, Inc., Promoting a dominionist "Christian Nation"
Cherry Hill Seminary Supports Patrick McCollum in 9th Circuit Case Against California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation http://snipurl.com/u8kcj ......
Dragonzmajick (2 comments)
Roeder verdict sparks fears of more anti-abortion violence
cross-posted at dKos Scott Roeder is likely to spend the rest of his life in prison for the murder of George Tiller.  At the very least, he'll by 75 years old before he can......
Christian Dem in NC (0 comments)
The dark underside of the Latter Rain--a walkaway's view
cross-posted at dKos I read Bruce Wilson's posts on dKos and Talk To Action regarding the "Pray For Newark" initiative with particular alarm.  While Pray for Newark appears to espouse an admirable goal--community empowerment--it's......
Christian Dem in NC (2 comments)
Bishops as Provocateurs
In a thinly-veiled reference to the campaign of President Barack Obama, Archbishop Emeritus of St. Louis, Raymond Burke, charged that Americans are "embracing a totalitarianism which masks itself as the 'hope,' the 'future' of......
bettyclermont (0 comments)
The Vatican v. Children
Yesterday was not a good day for children seeking justice from the Roman Catholic Church. The internet brought the following news: ......
bettyclermont (0 comments)
Religious bigots control supermarket chain
Well, they've won again.  The religious bigots have forced Publix Supermarkets into bowing to their wishes. ......
ArchaeoBob (11 comments)
Manhattan Declaration is to Theology what Fox is to Journalism
The December 20, 2009, New York Times ran a lengthy article by David D. Kirkpatrick about Robert P. George, "The Conservative-Christian Big Thinker." The occasion was release of George's "Manhattan Declaration" signed by the......
bettyclermont (2 comments)
Merry Freakin' Christmas: I'm Taking Your Stuff, and you Can't Stop Me!
A humorous look at the larger implications of a seemingly harmless holiday tradition. ......
John Sheirer (1 comment)
Lou Engle, September 25, 2007, Los Angeles: "Holywood"
[This is a partial transcription of a sermon/speech Lou Engle, Founder of TheCall gave on September 25, 2007, in Los Angeles. The full sermon is slightly over 63 minutes. This partial transcript is of......
Bruce Wilson (0 comments)
Rick Warren Tweet complains my videos of his "Hitler/Lenin/Mao" speech are unfair
It's gratifying to know "America's most powerful pastor" seems to have taken notice of my videos, showcasing Rick Warren's 2005 speech at California's Anaheim Angels Stadium, during which Warren outlined a "stealth" program to......
Bruce Wilson (4 comments)
Blurring Reproductive Rights and the Religious Right
The principle of the Hyde Amendment, which restricted federal funds from paying for abortion back in 1976 -- is now seen as an acceptable, "abortion neutral" position for the prochoice Democratic Party. How did......
Frederick Clarkson (0 comments)
Rick Warren Calls on Followers To Be Dedicated as Followers of Lenin and Mao
[note: for more recent news on Rick Warren, see Rick Warren's Dissertation Advisor Leads Network Promoting Uganda Anti-Gay Bill] Video, below contains audio recording, photos, and transcript from Rick Warren's April 17, 2005 speech......
Bruce Wilson (6 comments)
Julius Oyet Touts The College of Prayer
A new Talk To Action story identifies Apostle and bishop Julius Oyet as a major player in the recent effort in the Ugandan parliament to pass a draconian anti-gay bill. In this video [transcript......
Bruce Wilson (1 comment)
Mark Silk on the Hagee / Rodriguez Entente
Mark Silk, at Spiritual Politics has picked up on my notice of the Hagee-Rodriguez embrace and zeroes in on what's certainly one of the most notable aspects: "The key thing to understand about the......
Bruce Wilson (1 comment)
Inscribing Christian Values in our Children Before Birth?
Following the evolution of evangelical discourse as it re-defines homosexuality as evidence of "fallen creation", Terri Murray looks at how the Christian right have shifted their rhetoric to adapt to empirical research showing that......
TMurray (1 comment)
US News & World Report Showcases Creationist Ray Comfort
US News and World Report's Dan Gilgoff has charitably provided evangelist Ray Comfort a media platform in the form of a US News & World "exclusive" through which Comfort defends his efforts to distribute,......
Bruce Wilson (0 comments)
Atheist billboard in Central Florida
The organization "Atheists of Florida" sponsored a billboard promoting atheism in Lakeland, Florida.  I, however, have some concerns. ......
ArchaeoBob (4 comments)
Transcript: Billy Graham and Richard Nixon, February 21, 1973
The following is my own transcript of a 20 minute phone conversation between Richard Nixon and Billy Graham, on February 23, 1973. As far as I am aware this is the only publicly available,......
Bruce Wilson (0 comments)
Rifqa Bary being sent back to Ohio now
Well, there's a change in this case.  After the judge gets immigration documents and so on from the parents, he will send her back. ......
ArchaeoBob (2 comments)

More Diaries...




All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Comments, posts, stories, and all other content are owned by the authors. Everything else © 2005 Talk to Action, LLC. Powered by Scoop