Google WWW Talk To Action


The Indian River Incident : What You Can Do

link > The "Stop the ACLU Coalition" Shaming Project
How you can help stop "Stop The ACLU" just by sending a few emails



 'Left Behind' video game imageThe Shaming Project

does the violence of "Left Behind: Eternal Forces" bother you ? If so, what can you do ? Well, to begin with you can email Jonathan Hutson's stories to people you know. That will help to bring more public scrutiny of the game. Public shaming really works ! Just click on the "email" icon and link at the top or bottom of the story and you'll be taken to a form that will allow you email the first story, The Purpose Driven Life Takers or the latest installment without leaving this site. Thanks. 'Left Behind' video game image




Born Free? Al Mohler's Brave New World
By Kathryn JoyceTue Mar 20, 2007 at 03:14:41 PM EST
topic: Gay Rights section:Front Page printable version print this story
I'm not totally sure why Southern Baptist Theological Seminary president Al Mohler has gotten involved with the politics surrounding a German zoo and its polar bear cub, Knut, who was abandoned by his mother and is now being raised by Berlin zookeepers in a somewhat-controversial breach of animal welfare protocol. But I think it might have something to do with this: Mohler's highly controversial (for a reigning evangelical talking-head, that is) assertion that homosexuality may be biologically determined after all, and, if it's so determined, that Christians should embrace forthcoming technology that might be able to hormonally alter a fetus's sexual orientation.

For those who missed the controversy, Mohler recently stirred an inter-evangelical & gay-"ex-gay" debate when he riffed off a Radar article on the possibility of detecting sexual orientation in the womb, "Is Your Baby Gay," and mused that maybe, if parents could tell their fetus was destined to be gay, they could wear some sort of hormonal patch to straighten their future child out (thus saving the fetus from years of "straight" camps and baffling ex-gay ministries).

Mohler's original article, "Is your baby gay? What if you could know? What if you could do something about it?" also started with animals: gay sheep, specifically, and the scientific speculation that determining the biological components of the sheep's' gayness could lead to biological "cures" for gayness. Mohler summarized:

Homosexual activists were among the first to call for (and fund) research into a biological cause of homosexuality. After all, they argued, the discovery of a biological cause would lead to the normalization of homosexuality simply because it would then be seen to be natural, and thus moral.

But now the picture is quite different. Many homosexual activists recognize that the discovery of a biological marker or cause for homosexual orientation could lead to efforts to eliminate the trait, or change the orientation through genetic or hormonal treatments.

In a ten-point mini-study guide for Christians pondering the issue, Mohler then proposed that admitting a genetic cause for gayness, if one were found, need not be incompatible with the Bible, but rather Christians should look at it as a physical manifestation of the Fall: a Satan-shaped difference between gay and straight brains. Mohler also made clear that biologal findings need not interfere with Christian condemnation of homosexuality, as the Bible will hold firm on sin, but suggested that:

8. If a biological basis is found, and if a prenatal test is then developed, and if a successful treatment to reverse the sexual orientation to heterosexual is ever developed, we would support its use as we should unapologetically support the use of any appropriate means to avoid sexual temptation and the inevitable effects of sin.

Unsurprisingly, his suggestions riled both gay-rights activists and evangelicals wary of any attempts to cast homosexuality as anything other than a conscious choice. The Washington Post summed up some of the more contentious points on Friday:

For seeming to contradict a basic tenet of anti-gay thinking -- that homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, not a state of nature -- Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, was inundated with e-mails from readers who castigated him, he said on his blog Friday.

And for expressing his approval of a hypothetical prenatal intervention to change a baby's sexual orientation, he was verbally attacked by gay-rights advocates. Some of them likened him to the Nazi doctor Josef Mengele for seeming to advocate the manipulation of nature to "basically wipe out gay people," said Wayne R. Besen, founder of Truth Wins Out, a group that fights efforts to convert gays to heterosexuality.

Since then, ex-gay ministry leader (and member) Stephen Bennett has come to Mohler's defense, issuing the following statement:

"The reason Mohler's blog post drew so much media attention was the premise that the reader could walk away with: if someone is born a certain way, who are we to 'play God' and change nature?

Before repeating the necessary statement of faith (and redemption):

"The FACT is homosexuality - having NO scientific, biological basis whatsoever - IS ALREADY a changeable trait WITHOUT a patch or injection, one that I have personally received 14 years ago: Jesus Christ.

"No matter the future's findings or lack thereof, homosexuality is, was and always will be 'sin' in God's eyes - an immoral, sexually behavior based lifestyle that should and can be changed.

Former Operation Rescue head, and current Washington evangelical lobbyist Rev. Rob Schenk, tread a similarly fine line between admitting the possibility of biological cause (and ergo the possibility of a "cure"), while thanking Mohler for beginning an ethics conversation anti-gay Christian activists need to have now, before their "homosexual lifestyle choice" arguments are debunked by new research:

There will never be a quick, easy, strictly physical "cure" for sexual disorders and dysfunctions, hetero or homo. I'm convinced we will learn that spiritual, psychological, relational, experiential and environmental factors all combine with biological factors to produce certain human sexual proclivities and predilections--as is no doubt true of ALL human behaviors. Ultimately, of course, such dysfunctions are linked to the Fall and our resulting sinful state and consequent alienation from God the Creator. The cure for that underlying cause has already appeared.

But Schenk too can see a role for the hormonal "fix":

In the end it is intent that matters most. If our intent is to help a child develop normally and to enjoy a life designed by God for his or her happiness in service to the Lord and to His moral will--and there is a reasonable and demonstrable possibility of doing so with limited risk, then we should pursue it.

Inundated with hate-mail from his fellow Christians, Mohler himself quickly revised and clarified his position: that no matter its origin, sin is sin is sin:

Let's get this straight -- God's condemnation of sin is not determined by science, but by God's Word. The Bible could not be more clear -- all forms of homosexual behavior are expressly condemned as sin. In so doing the Bible uses its strongest vocabulary and places this condemnation in the larger context of the Creator's rightful expectation of our stewardship of the sexual gift. All manifestations of homosexuality are thus representations of human sinfulness and rebellion against God's express will. Nothing can alter this fact, and no discovery in science or any other human endeavor can change God's verdict.

So what does this have to do with polar bears? Probably precious little, but what strikes me is Mohler's common resort in both debates to employing vague definitions of Christian stewardship: a concept that has itself provoked numerous internal skirmishes between evangelicals debating the extent to which the principle implies support for liberal-seeming environmentalism. In lambasting a few German animal rights activists who had criticized the zoo's decision to hand-raise and bottle-feed a bear cub rejected by its mother, Mohler fell back on stewardship: God gave us animals to eat, wear, and enjoy watching in zoos. Therefore, we can intervene in nature if we want to, especially if it concerns an unmaternal mama-bear.

Now Mohler is similarly loose with his applications of the stewardship rule, citing sexual stewardship - that is, guarding God's gift of sexuality - as containing not just brow-beating anti-gay sermons, but also potentially the prenatal, hormonal manipulation of a fetus so that it is less inclined to sin, and more ready to enjoy God's plan for heterosexual fulfillment. Belatedly aware of how creepy and dystopian this sounds to outsiders (as well as near-blasphemous to his brethren), Mohler has tied the stewardship principle to human intervention with nature's course with a cute, media-darling bear cub: as though interfering with nature as he has suggested need not be reminiscent of Brave New World so much as "Born Free". And in fact "born free" is just the promise he's making: freeing people of the potential to sin, as he defines it. Hopefully the hostile reception he's encountered is a reminder not just of his own theology, which places great emphasis on free choice, but, among people less-inclined to God complexes, of the near-genocidal implications of promoting such a plan.




Display:
If ever there were a clandestine/ third world experimental medical procedure, this would be it. We hope that the West will not turn backward, but at the moment, homosexuality is not regarded as an illness, therefore, prenatal intervention to alter it is not justified. Since the last widespread prenatal hormonal intervention, DES,  has resulted in cancers and genitourinary defects (anything from hypospadias  (urethral orifice in penis at base) to urinary bladder extrophy (urinary bladder open to outside), one might expect most US MDs to be rather resistant to doing an intervention, for a normal condition, that might expose them to mega-lawsuits for the next 21 or more years.

by NancyP on Tue Mar 20, 2007 at 08:16:12 PM EST

I just love how the religious right cherry picks science. They scoff at Darwin and twist the discoveries of paleontology in order to justify creationism, but then embrace genetic science where homosexuality is concerned. Why? Because it gives them the opportunity to act upon their true motive: domination and control. They'll stop at nothing to foist their beliefs on others -- even unborn fetuses -- given any opportunity. They would never entertain the possibility, of course, that homosexuality is perhaps part of a larger divine plan that they don't yet understand (population control, anyone?). There are no accidents in nature -- except, apparently, where reality (science) contradicts religious idealogy.

by moviescribe on Wed Mar 21, 2007 at 10:35:25 PM EST

Imply that he thinks gay are cursed from birth, or even before birth ?

Of course, though, since God in the end is by Mohler's definition almighty, such a curse would ultimately have to be God's doing rather than Satan's.
 

by Bruce Wilson on Tue Mar 20, 2007 at 05:18:10 PM EST

He has rather unwittingly provided a real opening or chink in the anti-gay movement.  If homosexuality is biological and not a matter of free will (so-called 'lifestyle choice'), then the way is open for the whole "God made me this way" argument.  That's why the other fundies are upset over his article - it messes with a lot of their theology.

I suppose the bioethics are tricky - if it is a developmental side effect of the in-utero environment (like, say folic acid deficiency in the mother), or if it's genetic.  I'm glad I'm not a bioethicist.  It does seem to me, however, that it's very difficult to take a creationist view - we are created in God's image - and permit tinkering with the 'natural process' - the whole 'theology of life' logic which dictates that euthanasia is amoral  as is theraputic abortion, would also dictate that congenital therapy (is that the right construct?) is also immoral.  

by montpellier on Wed Mar 21, 2007 at 09:13:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]



"hate the sin, love the sinner" line, by which gays aren't cursed, but rather especially prone to "sin" in this way, but which then asserts that it's up to them not to sin by acting on their homosexuality. Mohler likened it to a special moral challenge, like a soldier on a battlefield who didn't ask to be put in a moral life-or-death quandry, but there he was in such a quandry, and he would be held accountable for his actions. Likewise, by Mohler's quick-footed accomodation of new science, a person born predisposed to be gay would just have a special burden from God that he would nonetheless have to deal with according to the Bible. The whole conversation, and Mohler's quasi-acceptance of the idea of a
"gay gene" seems like preparation for such new research: they want their arguments prepared in case new research disproves their "it's a lifestyle choice" rhetoric.

Promoting prenatal anti-gay therapy, on the other hand, is a pretty shocking, interventionist, turn though, especially for a movement that has so long relied on "natural law" type arguments against homosexuality.

by Kathryn Joyce on Tue Mar 20, 2007 at 06:23:11 PM EST

Kathryn, thank you for placing it on the site. I think it will be incumbent upon all of us to document the very clearly articulated, unambiguous vitriol that evangelicals have spouted for decades now about how homosexuality MUST be a choice - and as such, means that gays are to be held accountable for their 'sinful lifestyle choices.' Such glaring inconsistincies can be easily overlooked and forgotten in time as folk like Al Mohler become the mouthpiece for a movement within the evangelical household that adjusts to new and irrefutable evidence.
Shalom, Rev. Dr. John C. Dorhauer "Time makes ancient good uncouth; we must onward still and upward who would keep abreast of truth." from Lowell, "The Present Crisis"
by John Dorhauer on Wed Mar 21, 2007 at 09:31:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]


I am amazed that I agree with Albert Mohler about anything. That little baby bear is powerful! I am especially amazed, since I had written him off after reading the "gay baby" blog entries. I wish he would spend more time trying to keep innocent creatures from suffering, and less time trying to inflict suffering on gays and bisexuals of all ages.

by GreenEyed Lilo on Wed Mar 21, 2007 at 10:22:42 AM EST

Thanks once again, Kathryn, for an incisive piece of writing. These guys who throw around words like "stewardship" when it suits them need to be shown up as the cynical sophists they are. It's downright Orwellian ... and I know that's an overused term these days, but there you have it. If you pay a visit to the so-called Interfaith Stewardship Alliance you'll see how cynical it can get. Here you have a bunch of hardcore evangelical science deniers (when it suits them) who have appropriated the respectable name of the Interfaith Alliance , (is this actionable?) inserted a well chosen trendy word ("Stewardship"), and, Bob's Yer Uncle, set themselves up as the truly environmentally-minded protectors of the poor darker-skinned peoples of the world who are used as gratuitous clip art for their site. Quote: "The poor are are often the most injured by misguided though well-intentioned policies." Translation: "Let's do nothing about global warming, especially if it involves increased taxes for us, and let's pretend we are doing it (nothing) to help the poor peoples of the world."

There's also this gem, which I would call scriptural non sequitur if it even made that much sense:
‘Along with all the benefits we derive from economic use of energy, another consideration–a Biblical/theological one–points in the same direction. The stewardship [italics mine] God gave to human beings over the earth–to cultivate and guard the garden (Genesis 2:15) and to fill [like, with bulldozers?], subdue, and rule the whole earth (Genesis 1:28)–strongly suggests that caring for human needs is compatible with caring for the earth. As theologian Wayne Grudem [who he?] put it, “It does not seem likely to me that God would set up the world to work in such a way that human beings would eventually destroy the earth by doing such ordinary and morally good and necessary things as breathing, building a fire to cook or keep warm, burning fuel to travel, or using energy for a refrigerator to preserve food.”’

On the other hand, it does not seem likely to me that God would resort to such specious reasoning to buttress a truly awful argument for "stewardship".



by downstreamer on Tue Mar 27, 2007 at 11:12:08 AM EST

Left Behind: Eternal Forces: Installments of Jonathan Hutson's Talk To Action expose series on the "Left Behind: Eternal Forces" video game have been viewed by up to 1/2 million people. See our site section featuring Over 35 original articles covering the controversial "Left Behind: Eternal Forces" video game that has provoked a boycott by a coalition of religious groups and a letter writing campaign urging Walmart to stop selling the game. Media inquiries click here
(image: detail from Francoise Dubois' rendition of the Bartholomew's Day Massacre reveals the actual nature of religious warfare)

Focus On The Flip-Flop: Dobson Decides To Endorse McCain After All
Back in the fall of 2007, I attended the Family Research Council's "Values Voter Summit." The Republican presidential field was quite crowded then, and......
By Rob Boston (1 comment)
Palin and the Apostles
Palin's Churches and the Third Wave series Following is a compilation of the work that our research team has done in recent weeks on......
By Ruth (4 comments)
The Question Catholics Must Ask Sarah Palin
Bruce Wilson and Ruth have reported here at Talk to Action about Alaskan Governor and GOP Vice-Presidential nominee Sarah Palin's ties to the Wasila......
By Frank Cocozzelli (2 comments)
Short Takes
Street Prophets: Pastordan talks to the local press about why he won't be endorsing candidates from the pulpit -- unlike another Wisconsin pastor who......
By Frederick Clarkson (3 comments)
The Financial Crisis was Caused by Sex
Michael Heath thinks God gave us the crisis on Wall Street because he doesn't like America's approach to sex. While Heath is probably not......
By Frederick Clarkson (3 comments)
Biblical Stories and Urban Myths About Jews
Anti-Semitism is as old as the book of Exodus. Chapter One of the scrolls tells us in Verse 8, that the new king knew......
By wilkyjr (4 comments)
Fishers and Hunters - the Continuing Saga of Christian Zionism
Palin's Churches and the Third Wave series Two controversial stories featuring Sarah Palin were published in Jewish news sources last week. One was in......
By Ruth (3 comments)
Third Jihad Cover Design Changed
The Clarion Fund, currently on the receiving end of intense scrutiny over the tens of millions of dollars it recently spent giving away free......
By Richard Bartholomew (0 comments)
Palin's Apocalypse: A Video with Pertinent Questions
Senior Analyst, Political Research Associates (author info) Harry Hanbury of American News Project has crafted a video that raises serious issues regarding separation......
By Chip Berlet (4 comments)
Ban this Book -- Please!
Well, maybe not literally. But it could not be more appropriate that my current book is coming out in he middle of Banned Books......
By Frederick Clarkson (2 comments)
`Pulpit Freedom Sunday': The Next Steps
Yesterday Americans United reported six churches to the Internal Revenue Service for violating federal tax law by endorsing candidates from the pulpit. Five of......
By Rob Boston (1 comment)
Short Takes
Attytood: Discussing the dissemination of the anti-Islamic propaganda film Obsession: Free speech or hate speech? Houston Chronicle: Religious Right members of the Texas State......
By Frederick Clarkson (2 comments)
Muslim Children Gassed at Dayton Mosque After "Obsession" DVD Hits Ohio
On Friday, September 26, the end of a week in which thousands of copies of Obsession: Radical Islam's War Against the West -- the......
By Chris Rodda (23 comments)
The Continuing Absurdity of Walid Shoebat
The shadowy Clarion Fund's recent mass distribution of the anti-Muslim film Obsession via American newspapers has once again put the spotlight on Walid Shoebat,......
By Richard Bartholomew (3 comments)
More Jewish Wariness of Christian Zionism
A page on Jim Hutchens's "Jerusalem Connection" website includes an interesting detail: Unfortunately, what Caroline Glick decries in the following article was replicated by......
By Richard Bartholomew (2 comments)
"Seven Mountains" and the "Joel's Army" plan for takeover
In yesterday's post, I went into some of the initial detail on a statement given by Thomas Muthee in the infamous sermon where he "annointed" Sarah Palin and also claimed to literally run a......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
Christian Fascism
Sarah Palin's propulsion into politics was fueled by religious intolerance, organized through malicious harassment, and targeted at democracy. Her use of the power of the state to deny equal protection under the law and......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Politics of Thuggery
Much as most Americans prefer politics as entertainment, or at most as an informal seminar, the reality is that the politics of thuggery -- especially as practiced by the GOP -- is anything but......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Thomas Muthee's "Seven Mountains" and coded messages
Today's diary is--and yes, I know, this is a shocker--NOT going to be about Sarah Palin.  At least, not directly.  This is more towards some of her supporters...and especially in light of Palin throwing......
By dogemperor (1 comment)
New Model for Change
With American society in free fall, some activists are now reviewing the effectiveness of political organizing models they've used in the past. We suggest they include in their discussions two of our reports on......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Promoting Murder in America
Contrary to public opinion, promoting murder is not protected by the Constitution. Nor is it protected by tax exempt status, as in the case of charitable trusts and organized religions. The only place we......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
War of Ideas
<h2> Attacking the Truth</h2> Robert Parry talks about the role of right-wing US foundations in funding the attack on truth in media. ......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Vigil Land
I receive on average half a dozen e-mails from Bay Area activists* daily. Almost all of these unsolicited notices are for vigils held at various locations in Berkeley, Oakland, or San Francisco. In addition......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Defending Democracy
Defending democracy requires overcoming obstacles to moral conduct. ......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Thoughts and Deeds
There's a difference, as we know, between thoughts and deeds. Inciting hatred that leads to violence -- especially hatred based on rejection of human rights -- is more than just thinking; it's an act......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Israeli Exceptionalism
I often wondered how otherwise reasonable people in the US could believe in human equality and civil rights in our country, while at the same time opposing equality in Israel. Granted, ADL is much......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
"In God We Trust" License Plates passed in Florida
There is an article in the Lakeland Ledger about a new law starting the "In God We Trust" license plates.  There are two such plates- one is a regular plate in which the motto......
By ArchaeoBob (0 comments)
A Mandate from God
Paul de Armond explains why Christian militancy should concern us. As he observes, "A mandate from God is a powerful thing." ......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Prophets of Doom
America didn't suddenly become a nuthouse, that took some effort. While it's always been home to religious fanatics and prophets of doom, it's only by the mainstreaming of these damaged people that it seems......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Palin, TrooperGate, RapeKitGate...and Joel'sArmyGate
Over the past few weeks, folks on the Internet have turned up an impressive amount of info re Sarah Palin's questionable judgements--including scandals involving the Alaska State Police (now known as "TrooperGate") and similar......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
Criticizing Sister Sarah?
I just now got around to the posting about Keith Olbermann's evisceration of Sarah Palin. I saw that show and was a bit taken aback myself, largely because Keith took an obviously mark and......
By bughouse square (0 comments)
Palin, dominionist intimidation, and *actual* witch-hunters
A few days ago, I had reported on Palin's linkages to "Bible-based cult" promoter Bill Gothard...and, sadly, followup info proves that this may be far from her only links to religiously motivated abuse. It......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
Damaged People
Just like there are violent and non-violent people, there are violent and non-violent religions. In fact, they often go together.Not surprisingly, violent people who profess violent religious beliefs have frequently been on the receiving......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
Palin, Gothard, and dog-whistles to dominionists
A few days ago, I wrote an article detailing several more links between Palin and particularly disturbing elements of the "Joel's Army" movement--namely, apparent links between Palin and Bill Gothard's network of groups, and......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
A Pragmatic Arrangement
The political marriage of McCain and Palin isn’t the first time America’s aristocracy courted terrorists as bedfellows; the last time they openly displayed such a pragmatic arrangement was when the Taliban were entertained at......
By Jay Taber (0 comments)
New revelations re Palin and dominionists
Much like the US Postal Service, neither rain nor snow nor 70% of my hometown's power infrastructure being eaten by Ike will stop me from posting the latest on Palin's connections with dominionists. We've......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
The Next 50 Days and Women for Obama
"I know it's right, I know it's fair, I know in my heart we can change the world with my help. I will spend the next 50 days making my voice heard."-Deidre Hall ......
By eileen fleming (1 comment)
More info comes out on Palin and dominionism, Armageddon, and book bans
Over the past few days, I've been one of those Damned Annoying Palin Diarists--though not on BabyGate or some of the other stuff, but more on the fact she was originally put in as......
By dogemperor (0 comments)
Jewish and Christian Eschatology
      The following is an excerpt (Appendix XI) from my unpublished book manuscript entitled SEX, SWORDS AND SCRIPTURE: A SERMON OF SORTS.  It examines several biblical stories in terms of their deviation......
By June Fredman (0 comments)
"Curiouser and Curiouser!"
 ". . .  cried Alice, ( so much surprised that for the moment she quite forgot how to speak good English)."  Would that we were in a Lewis Carroll book from which we could......
By June Fredman (0 comments)
A Palin presidency may have literal apocalyptic consequences
Over the past few days I've been writing about Sarah Palin's extensive dominionist connections, including ongoing relationships with and even guest-preaching at and taxpayer support of several Assemblies and "Assemblies family" churches connected with......
By dogemperor (1 comment)
Transcript: Kaplan & Clarkson on Democracy Now!
The transcript and MP3 down load of Esther Kaplan and Frederick Clarkson talking with Amy Goodman on Democracy Now! can be found here. ......
By Frederick Clarkson (0 comments)
The problem with Sarah Palin
In light of John McCain's choice of Sarah Palin for Vice President, I feel compelled to write this letter. ......
By sirius (1 comment)
Links to Information and Documentaries on Palin's Churches
Sarah Palin’s Churches Series of Documentary Videos and Supporting Articles The following are links to articles and videos that have been posted on Talk2action.org in an ongoing series, documenting the research on Sarah Palin's......
By Bruce Wilson (0 comments)
Sarah Palin used AK tax dollars to fund dominionist churches
Over the past few days, I've done reporting on Sarah Palin's extensive dominionist connections--including the attempt to run her as a "stealth" dominionist candidate and her connections to some scary dominionist groups including not......
By dogemperor (1 comment)

More Diaries...